Platts 12th Annual Nuclear Energy Conference – Overall impressions
During the period of February 16-18, I attended the Platts 12th Annual Nuclear Energy Conference. For a number of reasons, I’ve been remiss in sharing some of my observations and thoughts about the conference. I wrote this up several weeks ago, but things move slowly in nuclear energy so most of it is probably still quite timely.
Cautious, uncertain, pragmatic optimism was perhaps the prevailing mood during 12th Annual Platts Nuclear Energy Conference. Yes, I know those adjectives present a mix of emotional states.
That is what happens when you gather a few hundred nuclear industry people together at a time when there are recent and near future operating plant closures; unknown regulatory burdens piled on in reaction to a distant event; palpable excitement about dozens of projects pursuing advanced reactors; steady but slower than desired progress in plant construction; seemingly unbeatable competition; a political tug-of-war regarding clean power planning; intriguing blue sky ideas from ARPA-E; and positive, but inadequate steps forward to address a long-recognized need to revise non-applicable regulatory requirements.
One of attendees took away the idea that the industry is disappointed that the Supreme Court has put a stay on implementing the Clean Power Plan. My impression from the people who mentioned the CPP was that they were mostly complaining about the way the implementation delay added one more uncontrollable uncertainty to an already challenging situation for decision makers.
Most of the attendees agreed that the plan, as issued, does little to encourage investments in existing nuclear plants, provides incentives for new plants that are delayed by at least half a dozen years after required investment decisions, and does too much to promote profitability of unreliable power sources that may not be available when customers need electricity.
There were several discussions about the future prospects for natural gas. Some attendees professed their faith in the Energy Information Agency’s (EIA) price projections. They are bewildered when confronted with history.
In 1970, the same agency predicted 1000 nuclear plants by 2000. In 1999 it predicted low natural gas prices for the foreseeable future.
EIA believers were unable to address the potential effects of the 75% reduction in active drilling rigs during the past 3-4 years, or the future impact of tight financing for dozens of highly leveraged exploration and production companies.
A number of presenters and audience members seemed to agree that the recent U.S. economic and energy consumption statistics prove that we have permanently decoupled prosperity from energy consumption. They think that the electrical power industry needs to adjust to flat or even slowly shrinking markets for its vital product.
A few, however, recognized the value of promoting increased electrification in transportation, space heating, and industrial process heat as part of a path towards a cleaner, less costly, and more flexible energy supply system. They just aren’t sure who is supposed to lead those promotional efforts.
Too many people used the phrase that makes me cringe “the U.S. needs a national energy policy.” I’ve been hearing that since the winter of my first year of middle school in 1971. That year, parts of the U.S. Northeast were hit with natural gas shortages that closed schools and businesses.
Our country’s strength rides on its diversity, adversarial judicial system, and competitive free enterprise system. Energy is too big of a business with too much opportunity for technological advancement for us to ever agree on a national energy policy.
One of the more important conference talks was provided by Commissioner William Ostendorff. He has served since April 2010 and is nearing the end of his second term, which expired June 30, 2016.
For the first question after his talk, Darius Dixon of Politico asked Commissioner O if he was going to seek reappointment. For the first time in public, Ostendorff announced that he was proud of his service and what the commission had accomplished during the past six years, but that he had already accepted a new position as a Distinguished Visiting Professor of National Security Studies at the U.S. Naval Academy, his alma mater.
After learning of his future plans, I reviewed his speech and realized that he would be a tough opponent at a poker table. There was no hint in that talk of any future activities other than what the Commission was doing to fulfill its assigned mission and to prepare for its future in interesting times.
Commissioner Ostendorff then described how the commission was reviewing 26 combined license applications when he arrived, but is now only reviewing six.
“Clearly, the industry has changed. Shale gas, declining electricity demand, energy efficiency, lack of a carbon tax… All kinds of factors in which many of you are expert. I’m not. This dynamic over the last two years has caused, appropriately, the commission to embark on a plan to look at “what is the right size for the agency, our agency, the NRC. We ramped up for the Nuclear Renaissance, it has not materialized. Proper fiscal stewardship of resources, taxpayer and licensee dollars demands that we reduce our agency size. So this backdrop of industry status has led to what we call project AIM.”
He then went on to describe the actions the agency is taking to do better work with fewer people and to shed some work that they have traditionally done.
With almost the next breath, he described how the agency has successfully awarded two new design certifications, three early site permits, seven combined licenses and completed a long drawn out Part 50 operating license at Watts Bar unit 2.
Those experiences have provided the agency with a contingent of people experienced with new reactor licensing. If those individuals and teams are nurtured, having completed the full process at least once will enable them to improve review performance for additional combined licenses, small modular reactor licensing and advanced reactor licensing.
He described how the commission has accepted a staff recommendation to prepare a rulemaking that would create consequence-based criteria for Emergency Planning Zones.
They would be based on a mechanistic source term for small modular reactors and advanced reactors. That means designers would not be forced into assuming that their reactor cores could magically be dispersed past all engineered barriers. Instead, they could show how material properties, physics and chemistry contain potential releases.
Applicants will be able to prove, using modeling or testing, how their reactors can limit consequences even with smaller EPZs.
The commission is planning to establish a 39-month standard for reviewing high quality license applications for light water SMRs.
He also showed a slide of three non-light water reactors that were once licensed in the U.S. and how those proved that the agency was capable of licensing non-LWR power plants. Every one of the plants pictured (Fermi, Peach Bottom 1 and Ft. St. Vrain) had been licensed by the Atomic Energy Commission before 1970.
He described the actions being taken — with limited resources — to prepare for advanced reactor licensing. As a gesture to show the priority of those efforts, the commission has requested $5 million in FY2017 for non light water reactor advanced reactors. Justifying that small budget item required numerous meetings with appropriations committee staffs and with OMB.
Aside: This fact is one of the reasons why I believe that an independent agency should have a budgetary process that is not linked to the politically charged annual budget process. The current process puts policy determination into the hands of accountants at OMB. End Aside.
He issued a plea for the many different groups who currently claim to speak to the NRC for the advanced reactor community of interest to coordinate their requests, even while acknowledging the impossibility of unanimity.
When answering a question about regulatory costs, he acknowledged that plants are robustly (emphasis in original) protected against security threats and that both the agency and the industry had woefully underestimated costs for requirements implemented in reaction to 9-11. He stated that the NRC is at risk of following a similar pattern with cybersecurity but was unwilling to offer any specifics on regulations that might be relaxed to lower cost burdens.
I asked if a similar trend had happened with rules issued post Fukushima and were all of the requirements really needed for safety. He said, emphatically, yes, and that great care was taken to make sure that the implementation was done in a thoughtful way, wasn’t overkill, and was needed to ensure safety going forward.
My sources tell me that the reported costs ignore some of the related costs uncovered during implementation, do not include provisions for long term maintenance, training, and on-call staffing, and most importantly, do nothing to increase the ability of the plants to generate electricity. With just modest amounts of luck, none of the equipment installed or put into the seismically isolated buildings will ever be used.
There has been a noticeable, but small step increase in average annual CAPEX following Fukushima. In the years prior to that event, most of the incremental capital was spent on projects that resulted in power updates and increased annual electricity sales.
I anticipate that an industry group with access to the cost details of the Fukushima Frenzy will release them for public scrutiny and comment. I think those all-cost, no-return investment requirements may be a factor in the plant closing decisions.
I followed up with Commissioner O several days after the event to clarify a few points and perhaps to plant a few seeds for consideration.
We discussed the specifics about his arrival status of reviewing applications for 26 individual units and the current review status seven current applications. We agreed that the impression of a Renaissance that never arrived is a little too stark.
Most of the applications arrived in a short burst of excitement following the passage of the Energy Policy Act of 2005. Its set of numerically limited, but reasonably generous, incentives set off a race where only the early finishers would be rewarded. It’s no surprise that many entrants quit once it became clear that they were out of the money.
Of the initial 26, seven have now received completed combined licenses; their reviews are no longer in progress. Seven more (two at Turkey Point, two at W.S. Lee, two at Levy County, and 1 at North Anna) are still under active review. At least one more project still has an active environmental review in progress, even though the rest of the project has been suspended.
Many of the awarded COLs and some of the projects under review are still in the wait and see mode, but they have the reasonably short turnaround option to begin moving forward as uncertainties in markets, financing, emissions regulations, final construction costs for Vogtle and Summer and other factors are resolved.
Commissioner O and I also discussed the importance of the Agency’s efforts to document as many lessons learned about the licensing processes as possible. He agreed that the agency understands no knowledge management system is perfect and knows that there is real value in retaining individuals who have gained operating experience with the current licensing system.
It is incumbent on people that care about new large LWR projects, SMRs and advanced reactors to help the agency focus on retaining key people. Without some squeaky wheels who emphasize the importance of readiness for new application review and new construction supervision, it will be too easy for the agency to focus on the demands from current licensees to reduce head count.
Executive agencies like the NRC are in a difficult position to prepare for future demands. They can be classified as “whining” or “empire building” if they look ahead to line up appropriate resources.
They need people that plan to engage their regulatory services to press Congressional representatives and appropriate members of the Executive Branch (Secretary of DOE, the Office of Management and Budget, the President etc) to furnish adequate and timely resources.
Energy market dynamics and technologies have changed since the 1980s when David Stockman recommended that the NRC be mostly funded by fees on existing nuclear plants. So have society’s concerns about air pollution, water pollution, ocean acidification and global climate change.
The NRC has an assigned responsibility to the public to be an expert in the safety aspects of the reasonably mature reactor designs that have been attracting new investor interest. It’s difficult for me to use the phrase “advanced reactor” to describe systems like Prism, HTGRs, and certain molten salt designs. They represent more than a half a century of innovation, development and testing. They’re innovative and have a different business model than large light water reactors, but their technologies are hardly mysterious. They’re in all the best textbooks and taught in all of the best university programs.
The nuclear industry faces uncertain times, but much of the responsibility for resolving uncertainty rests within the people who are thinking, planning and leading. They cannot simply wait and see; the competition isn’t passive and isn’t going away anytime soon.
“A number of presenters and audience members seemed to agree that the recent U.S. economic and energy consumption statistics prove that we have permanently decoupled prosperity from energy consumption.”
Is this really true? Given how much we import, haven’t we shifted energy use overseas and disguised it in the goods we import? Our new energy source is the Federal Reserve.
I noted that too, FermiAged. Also that the author — perhaps intentionally — neglected to quantify just how large “a number” actually is. In an earlier thread you remarked upon those who seemingly favor energy poverty and restricted transportation as key elements of a national energy policy.
Perhaps this is the sort of thing of which Rod is skeptical. It may be a matter of definition. We already have a national energy policy. However our energy markets operate, they do so by our choice. That is our policy. Production Tax Credits, Renewable Energy Standards, arbitrarily restricted definitions of “renewable”, Net Metering, Grid Priorities, cheap fracked gas, prohibitions against local communities’ regulation of drilling practices or locations — these are all
cornercobble stones of our National Energy Policy.As it exists today. Some of us would like the lot replaced with a National Carbon Fee and Dividend. That too would be a National Energy Policy.
Left unmentioned was the number who do not agree our economic prosperity has become permanently decoupled from energy consumption. For example, there is a team at DOE’s Lawrence Berkeley and Pacific Northwest National Laboratories who, in their 2014 Pathways to Deep Decarbonization in the United States 2050 Report, suggest an energy profile containing a healthy 43% drop in personal energy consumption over 35 years. With a projected 36% population growth, this results in a net 20% decrease in overall US energy consumption.
Does that decouple prosperity from energy consumption? Again a matter of definition. Total energy consumption does drop with increased efficiency. But much of the remaining energy is of an exceedingly high-quality variety: over those 35 years U.S. electricity generation is expected to double.
@Ed Leaver
…suggest an energy profile containing a healthy 43% drop in personal energy consumption over 35 years. With a projected 36% population growth, this results in a net 20% decrease in overall US energy consumption.
Does that decouple prosperity from energy consumption? Again a matter of definition. Total energy consumption does drop with increased efficiency.
I don’t see anything “healthy” about a 43% drop in personal energy consumption over a 35 year period. I also don’t agree that overall energy consumption falls with increased energy efficiency; normally increased efficiency lowers energy costs enough to allow the customers to add additional energy consuming activities to their lifestyle.
During this period, wages have stagnated and it has become necessary to redefine unemployment to make the numbers look better.
It occurs to me that the best thing that could happen to natural gas AND nuclear, is for a bunch of export terminals to come online. Nat Gas companies could open up markets in Europe, Japan, and elsewhere which would make their product much more valuable. . . and natural gas would become expensive enough domestically that it would create a good market for nuclear power to come back.
The problem with the idea that energy efficiency ‘decouples’ energy and prosperity is that,
A) you still need a lot of energy – just maybe a bit less than before;
B) while it’s great that I can run a light bulb with less energy than I used to, or my computer, or heat my home (because of better insulation) with less energy, there are a lot of people living in energy poverty (generally, people living in financial poverty, and food poverty too) currently that we need to raise up out of that energy poverty – so even as I may need less energy, we should, as a society, be trying to increase the use of energy of those in poverty, and
C) Society, in order to increase or continue prosperity, may need to use more energy in other ways – for example, desalinating water; recycling municipal trash streams, pulling CO2 and Nitrogen out of the air to create carbon neutral plastics, polymers, fertilizers, etc; as well as doing a lot of large scale infrastructure construction – it’s well known that the US need to make trillions of dollars of investment into infrastructure construction in the coming decades – and that’s not even including new infrastructure that will almost surely be needed to combat ocean rise and other effects of global warming.
@Rod Adams
Pfffffffft! A mere quibble. As Jevons pointed out, increased efficiency needn’t result in increased consumption if accompanied by rising price.
What drives the efficiency? What drives adoption of CHP, heat pumps, and electric and/or hydrogen transport? A residential heat pump can keep your house just as cool on 1/3 the electric energy, or just as warm on a third the btu’s. Those are expensive btu’s, but when I lived in Austin 15 years back, they had become quite popular for new construction. Likewise today electric cars drive the same distance as an ICE on 1/3 or 1/4 the energy. But it’s high-quality energy, and if it comes from coal one’s emissions profile, while improved, is not improved to quite the degree one might like.
The 43% personal energy reduction was chosen by the DOE dudes as a maximum they thought Americans might tolerate without overly crimping our style.
They also didn’t consider more than 40% penetration of nuclear power into our electricity grid: perhaps management didn’t like the direction the cost projections were trending. But that 40% represents a quadrupling of current capacity, or maybe 300 new GW LWRs if we can hold on to our old ones. An average of 10 completions each year from 2020 on out. Is higher penetration reasonable within that time period? A rhetorical question. But what policies can drive it?
Yes, Jeff.
That certainly would be a natural series of events.
True statement. Manufacturing jobs and the associated Industrial load have been offshored. The steel mill towns in Indiana, Ohio, and Pennsylvania are ghost towns compared to the 1960s. Similarly, we export cotton to Asia and buy clothes, two trips across the ocean being cheaper than manufacturing here.
While on the subject of industrial offshoring and job loss, the Environmental Protection Agency and the myriad of other regulators played no small part in that phenomenon. Given enough regulation (even nuclear), the process can become so expensive that it is profitably exported to a less regulated region.
For a fact our country prints the money it cannot raise by taxation, and the Federal Reserve facilitates that function by funding deficits. Nearly $20 Trillion – with the end nowhere in sight. Incredible.
Re: Jeff S
March 21, 2016 at 5:30 PM
That’s one bright concept, but while all this is playing out till nuclear’s economic advantage what’s happening to Co2 levels in the atmosphere? (is there an irreversible climate change “tipping point”?)
James Greenidge
Queens NY
This morning on a major feature on CBS Morning News, the reporter Jenkin Duncan was having a cow about how the Brussels attacks will effect “the protection and progress” of all nuclear plants — of course complete with irrelevant footage of Fukushima (just can’t get enough of masked bunny-suited workers!) and how “EASY” is to hack into plant computers and stealing radio materials and that the nuclear terrorist peril can only be reduced by abolishing such plants like nearby Germany (big sigh of relief for German’s foresight!!) I’m just waiting on any certified pro nuclear advocate orgs to knock on CBS’s door for a little correction if not equal time! Greenpeace sure isn’t!
James Greenidge
Queens NY
Re: Nuclear plant security.
Yes, correct me if I’m naive, but if some of the biggest rural banks can confidently hold tens of millions of dollars only a few yards away from their customers during the day and feel just as secure their contents will still be there regardless a mass assault of wannebe break-ins overnight, why do you need a virtual (high PR fright factor) army to secure the contents of a nuclear plant? It harkens to what Goldfinger said about Fort Knox; yes, it holds far more and is more secure than most facilities but nevertheless it’s still a bank (nothing ultra unique). Maybe nuclear plant builders first should ask bank builders how to secure a location with the least manpower and concrete and acreage. I especially worry when NEI and ANS chronically don’t point out that there are far less secure chemical plants around where a few pounds of C-4 the right place could asphyxiate the population of a small city. Anyone ever seen the stuff piled around Elizabeth NJ, right up close to NYC??
James Greenidge
Queens NY
On the same theme, I saw a recent International Energy Agency (not International Atomic Energy Agency, to be clear, which is a different thing) forecast which involved a large drop in global energy demand attributed to the “transition from a manufacturing to a service economy”. Given that this so-called transition has been achieved in the formerly industrialized countries by importing goods from overseas, just where do they expect the goods to come from if the whole world goes that route?
It’s the worst kind of bad reasoning.
@publius
On the same theme, I saw a collection of 2011 studies from Pacific Northwest National Laboratory, University of Maryland, and PBL Netherlands Environmental Assessment Agency that predicted just the opposite, namely a four-fold increase in global electricity generation by the end of the century. See Allison Thomson et al. RCP4.5: a pathway for stabilization of radiative forcing by 2100. Climatic Change (2011) 109:77–94 DOI 10.1007/s10584-011-0151-4, and references therein. Some of their figures are posted here, but read the original article for fullest effect.
That certainly seems more reasonable than the contents of “World Energy Outlook 2014” as reported here. Also I note nobody has really begun to integrate the lessons of the recent work on methane leakage, which seems to turn the whole “green gas” argument on its head, at least so far as climate questions are concerned.
Not surprisingly, the methane problem is subject to differing interpretations: see Ted Nordhaus Misleading New Chemistry: Separating Fact from Fiction in the Fracking Debate. On the other hand, as part of her Vision for Modernizing North American Energy Infrastructure Hilary Clinton wants to
* Repair or replace thousands of miles of outdated pipelines to improve safety and reduce methane leaks…
* Improve pipeline regulations, including instituting automatic or remote-controlled shut-off valves and leak detection standards that have been recommended by the National Transportation Safety Board.
* Work to close the loophole that allows companies to ship oil sands crude without paying into the Oil Spill Liability Trust Fund.
* Increase public investment in clean energy R&D, including in storage technology, designed materials, advanced nuclear, and carbon capture and sequestration. Expand successful innovation initiatives, like ARPA-e, and cut those that fail to deliver results…
… such as carbon capture and sequestration?
[/snark]. The coal generation problem is huge and CCS would certainly be welcome were it to ever work on the required scale. Some — I won’t name names — might even suggest the coal problem is large enough that China’s HTR approach bears some scrutiny as well. The U.S. Deep Decarbonization Pathways 2050 report linked in my first comment above recommends Power-to-Gas as the most cost-effective energy storage in this country due to our existing gas infrastructure. Secretary Clinton’s infrastructure plans might keep that possibility in mind. Senator Sanders might also find it attractive.
The way I see it, CCS has several issues:
– It’s really expenssive;
– It’s unlikely that storage will ever be sufficient for the amounts of CO2 continuously being produced;
– In the case of underground storage (ex. old mines), there’s the risk of fracture due to erosion/earthquakes which would cause waves of CO2 to wash over the land (see Lake Nyos for potential immediate consequences), eventually ending back in the atmosphere;
– It doesn’t solve the particulate/heavy metal pollution aspect of coal’s dirtiness.